Is This Coin on Ebay Real?

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Here's the Coin, Its a gothic crown :8D
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1847-British-Queen-Victoria-Crown-Silver-Coins/232288819212?_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851&_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D2%26asc%3D40130%26meid%3D7ea760ce7b7542dd9215ae9f88143f6f%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D6%26sd%3D302249207198
Sayan Biswas The Coin Collector
Here's some tips for you to identify if the item is looked genuine or not.

1. Origin of coins selling
-Is the coin seller experienced and has reliable ratings?
-What country is the item sold from?
-Is the coins start from very low price?
-Is the item reasonable to be shipped from?

2. Coin appearance
-Is it reasonable to have good grading in that period?
-Is the coin matched all properties of a corresponding genuine coin?
-Rarity of coins (is it supposed appeared slabbed more than ungraded?)

3. Another products offered by seller
-Does the seller selling any items that looking suspecious on its authenticity?

I'm sure you'll find the answer;)
Quote: "LCW1991"​Here's some tips for you to identify if the item is looked genuine or not.

​1. Origin of coins selling
​-Is the coin seller experienced and has reliable ratings?
​-What country is the item sold from?
​-Is the coins start from very low price?
​-Is the item reasonable to be shipped from?

​2. Coin appearance
​-Is it reasonable to have good grading in that period?
​-Is the coin matched all properties of a corresponding genuine coin?
​-Rarity of coins (is it supposed appeared slabbed more than ungraded?)

​3. Another products offered by seller
​-Does the seller selling any items that looking suspecious on its authenticity?

​I'm sure you'll find the answer;)
​I Found The Answer...... IT IS FAKKEEEE8~:o
:O
Sayan Biswas The Coin Collector
The sellers name kinda gave it away that it was a fake.
Restoration addict : Verdigris Removal : Zinc White spot removal : Iron Rust Removal : Silver brooch/necklace mount Removal
Shipping:
$4.00 ePacket delivery from China | See details

Item location:
China, China
Non illegitimis carborundum est.  Excellent advice for all coins.
Make Numismatics Great Again!  
But It Looks Gorgeous :love::P
Sayan Biswas The Coin Collector
Say the seller's name and country of origin weren't huge red flags. Is there something on the picture that would make you think it's a fake? Because it looks really great to me (in fact the one detail that would make me doubt is the fresh-off-the-mint unc condition). Also, the diameter and weight listed are indeed those you'd expect of the actual coin.
Oh my god the Bid Rose to 70 USD :o
it is fake.... still 70 dollars?
Sayan Biswas The Coin Collector
Too dangerous to bid here in my opinion. I would't trust it.
If you look at the bidders also all are anonymous bidders, that smells like danger to me.
If you like coins, medals and tokens with ship motives follow my new instagram account with regular updates @numisnautiker
From time to time I sell some coins on Ebay make sure to follow me @apuking on Ebay.
Quote: "BryanJ"
​ Say the seller's name and country of origin weren't huge red flags. Is there something on the picture that would make you think it's a fake? Because it looks really great to me (in fact the one detail that would make me doubt is the fresh-off-the-mint unc condition). Also, the diameter and weight listed are indeed those you'd expect of the actual coin.
​Well, common sense. I'm guessing if you had a pristine Gothic Crown, arguably the finest example outside of museum collections, you wouldn't sell it on eBay using a new account, without any history, based in a country synonymous with counterfeiting. This just isn't how coins with a price tag in excess of $20,000 are sold. It's so obviously an $2 Alibaba knockoff and sadly the bid is already at $70 with 24 hours to go. Predatory sellers need gullible buyers. If someone just has to have a copy of one of the world's most sought after coins then why not buy it from the source for a few bucks instead of paying what might well be several hundred bucks for a "real' one" Or even better, just buy one of the semi legitimate NCLT coins struck with the gothic image by Malta(?).

I wouldn't put much stock in the photo or the specs, the coin which will be mailed is going to be seriously underweight (silver is much heavier than the pot metal used in Shanghai Specials), it will stick to a magnet and instead of the beauty in the photo it will be a nasty cast copy with none of the finer details captured and "orange peel" fields.

I'm not in the market for anything so expensive, I've never owned such a coin and the only examples I've actually held were much lower grade. So I can't point to a specific area and say "it's fake because of <xxxxx>." Although I would be wondering why the heraldic lions don't have any faces, why there is no toning and not a single blemish after 170 years! If I was, I'd be doing a whole lot of research and I wouldn't be buying it from eBay.
Non illegitimis carborundum est.  Excellent advice for all coins.
Make Numismatics Great Again!  
Yeah, of course if I could afford this coin I'd buy it from a very reputable seller, and certainly not on ebay (and especially not from a seller who's from a country that's synonymous with mass counterfeiting) . I was just wondering if there was some detail in the picture that gave it away (to train my eyes if you will), other than the suspiciously perfect condition. Maybe some difference with the genuine article. That was silly because you're right, the coin you'd receive would probably look nothing like the picture and the weight & diameter would differ from what's listed. Also I'm not used to that yet but yeah, such a valuable coin would 100% be slabbed.
There's also the matter of provenance Bryan. An already rare coin is made even more rare by it's purported condition. A coin like this, if it were genuine, would create a huge stir at the top end of the numismatic market. A halfway decent auctioneer would know exactly who to call to make sure that this coin was on the cover of every coin collecting publication in the world. Yet for 170 years, nothing.

There are only a few examples of top tier coins and in general they are all accounted for and have proven histories going back over the decades. There are well known exceptions, the legendary missing 1933 penny which had a whole generation of schoolboys checking their pocket money is a perfect example. I like to think that one day it will actually turn up, preferably in a bulk lot I've just purchased. When it does it will be accompanied by a great deal of excitement and fanfare and the story of it's discovery will become part of numismatic folklore. Pretty sure it won't just turn up on eBay though. ;)

Provenance.... it's not something which us peasants who grub around the (more enjoyable in my opinion) gutters looking for our treasures encounter very often but it's very real.

It might be a picture of a real coin, I don't know but the missing faces on the lions look like a dead giveaway to me. I'm always reluctant to identify specifics when it comes to fakes. It's known that counterfeiters scour coin forums looking for clues to improve their product. Some forums discourage such topics for that reason.

It does occur to me having reread it, (and the tone of your response which I might be entirely misreading), that my original reply might have been somewhat abrasive or condescending. It wasn't my intention to convey either impression to a man who's opinion I value very much. I guess I'm having a bad time of things recently and my normal urbane and affable self will return soon.
Non illegitimis carborundum est.  Excellent advice for all coins.
Make Numismatics Great Again!  
Quote: "apuking"​Too dangerous to bid here in my opinion. I would't trust it.
​If you look at the bidders also all are anonymous bidders, that smells like danger to me.
​^^This, this.....and ^^^^^THIS

I see no need for any seller to have their listings "private", It does not make sense at all why to do it with eBay coins. The design of the Gothic Crown is amazing, but this coin just doesn't show much time has passed and does not come close to the real thing as far as the fine details. Like the jewels, brooch and dress stitching diamond details.

This is what I spotted immediately.



It is easy to get lost in a Gothic Crown design, closer inspection will reveal mistakes all over it.
Restoration addict : Verdigris Removal : Zinc White spot removal : Iron Rust Removal : Silver brooch/necklace mount Removal
Quote: "pnightingale"Or even better, just buy one of the semi legitimate NCLT coins struck with the gothic image by Malta(?).
​I heard somewhere, a while ago, that the Liberian NCLT versions of the famous US $4 Stella actually have much smaller mintages than the originals - but they're a lot more available and a lot less valuable anyway.

I myself was almost taken by an auction (not eBay) with a bunch of what should have been ludicrously rare coins (much rarer than the gothic crown, IIRC). Fortunately I realized my mistake before I paid, and the bidding platform being what it was the seller couldn't really do much with my non-payment other than impotently rage (and maybe send me a negative review, which I would have ignored because I realized auctions weren't my thing and abandoned that platform a few days later anyway).
Still have the only other coin I bought on that auction site (a crap grade dateless Matron US cent). I think the site ended up closing a few years later (for unrelated reasons).
Quote: "Fluke"
​This is what I spotted immediately.



​It is easy to get lost in a Gothic Crown design, closer inspection will reveal mistakes all over it.

​Good work! I don't see how the got so much right and then messed up her sleeve so miserably!
Taking a break from swapping for a while, but still interested in pre 1799 Spanish coins, I will make time for that!

Looking for pre 1783 coins
Quote: "pnightingale"​There's also the matter of provenance Bryan. An already rare coin is made even more rare by it's purported condition. A coin like this, if it were genuine, would create a huge stir at the top end of the numismatic market. A halfway decent auctioneer would know exactly who to call to make sure that this coin was on the cover of every coin collecting publication in the world. Yet for 170 years, nothing.

​There are only a few examples of top tier coins and in general they are all accounted for and have proven histories going back over the decades. There are well known exceptions, the legendary missing 1933 penny which had a whole generation of schoolboys checking their pocket money is a perfect example. I like to think that one day it will actually turn up, preferably in a bulk lot I've just purchased. When it does it will be accompanied by a great deal of excitement and fanfare and the story of it's discovery will become part of numismatic folklore. Pretty sure it won't just turn up on eBay though. ;)

​Provenance.... it's not something which us peasants who grub around the (more enjoyable in my opinion) gutters looking for our treasures encounter very often but it's very real.

​It might be a picture of a real coin, I don't know but the missing faces on the lions look like a dead giveaway to me. I'm always reluctant to identify specifics when it comes to fakes. It's known that counterfeiters scour coin forums looking for clues to improve their product. Some forums discourage such topics for that reason.

​It does occur to me having reread it, (and the tone of your response which I might be entirely misreading), that my original reply might have been somewhat abrasive or condescending. It wasn't my intention to convey either impression to a man who's opinion I value very much. I guess I'm having a bad time of things recently and my normal urbane and affable self will return soon.

I did not take offense with your reply, and rest assured I did not mean my response to imply I did.

I was asking for the purpose of learning which details to look for on a picture because that particular image didn't scream "fake" to me, but I realize that you can't just ignore the context of a coin (especially one such as this one). You've got to play spot the difference and check the context to have a reasonably sound grasp of whether a coin could be genuine.

​ Good point about the lions. This is the kind of things I tend to somewhat uncounsciously chalk up to wear (which obviously I should not do in this case). It's weird because they got some of them right, and the leftmost one looks great.

Thanks for the comparison, Fluke. It seems you really have to check the finer details, there are some very good counterfeits.
Unlike this one:
https://ae01.alicdn.com/kf/HTB1kfwEKpXXXXa8XXXXq6xXFXXXO/XDD0101B-30-Pieces-Silver-Gothic-Crown-of-1847-The-British-Coin-of-Queen-Victoria-Brass-Core.jpg :`
Quote: "Sayan"​Oh my god the Bid Rose to 70 USD :o
​it is fake.... still 70 dollars?

And it sold for $305! :(
:( Oh no...... The person whose money it is, has a very bad luck.....
Sayan Biswas The Coin Collector
Quote: "Sayan":( Oh no...... The person whose money it is, has a very bad luck.....


​No he/she can re-sell it to another ignorant buyer from a perfectly "safe-to-buy-coins" country, say the USA for example. So sad.
I don't send via registered mail with very few exceptions.
There's a magnificent example that was just sold:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/361936577971

I don't get why it sold relatively "cheap": the seller seems trustworthy, the PCGS number checks out. I know its grade is "only" 55, but that should still command a higher price. Why sell that on ebay? Also, why didn't I have $2500 laying about?

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